4:13 Podcast: Can I Avoid Bitterness When a Friendship Fails? With Elizabeth Laing Thompson [Episode 276]

Elizabeth Thompson: I think friendship breakups are one of the most painful kind of losses. I know when I have been through this, it's this complicated cocktail of emotions. I think there's a lot of shame and regret. I think -- because in any friendship breakup, you feel a sense of guilt like, What did I do wrong? You feel insecure like, Am I unlikable? Am I unlovable? Am I, like, secretly destroying my other friendships? There's just so much complicated, negative emotion that goes along with it.

Jennifer Rothschild: We all long for forever friends. But what happens when forever ends? Friends are the family that we choose. And with that choice comes great joy, but also great risk, because sometimes those friendships fall apart. And so if that has happened to you, help is on the way. Today, author Elizabeth Thompson is going to give you practical tools for your friendships that may be faltering or fractured. Or maybe they're even on the verge of failure. Well, we are going to deal with forgiveness, reconciliation, and expectations and how to know when and if it is time to walk away. I'm telling you, this conversation is full of some faith-filled wisdom, so let's get it going.

K.C. Wright: Welcome to the 4:13 Podcast, where practical encouragement and Biblical wisdom set you and I up to live the "I Can" life, because you can do all things through Christ who strengthens you.

Now, welcome your host, Jennifer Rothschild.

Jennifer Rothschild: Hi, friends. We're glad you're back with us today. That was K.C. Wright. He and I are in the podcast closet. I'm Jennifer, just to help you be and do more than you feel capable of as you're living this "I Can" life. And it is two friends, one topic, zero stress.

Today our one topic is friendship. So how perfect that K.C. and I have been friends for so many years and we get to do this podcast together.

K.C. Wright: Seriously.

Jennifer Rothschild: Thankfully, our friendship is not falling apart.

K.C. Wright: No. No, it's not.

Jennifer Rothschild: No. And, in fact, that's why we are not falling apart, because we have a strong friendship. And I'm so thankful.

And you know what, I got to give one shoutout before we even talk about friendship. We were planning to do the podcast today, and K.C. was going to get here at noon to record. And I texted him at, I don't know, 11:30 and said, "Oh, my gosh, we can't do the podcast." Because my husband, Phil, and I, we had been over at the lake about an hour from our home.

K.C. Wright: Right.

Jennifer Rothschild: And, you know, it's just so sweet to go to the lake in the winter when it's quiet.

K.C. Wright: Yes. Yes.

Jennifer Rothschild: Anyway, I had been working, writing, and I realized I did not have my computer, which I needed for recording. And that man drove all the way back to get it, then came all the way back when he had his own work to do.

K.C. Wright: He's a good man.

Jennifer Rothschild: Big shout out for my Dr. Phil, everyone. Go ahead --

K.C. Wright: Shout out, yes.

Jennifer Rothschild: -- in 4:13 land. Thank you. I so appreciate that man. He is a good man.

Okay. But anyway, friendship is a fun topic because -- I love friendship songs. Like, I'm one of those. Okay? Like, even the one from Toy Story, (singing) you got a friend in me. I mean, I love that.

K.C. Wright: I know.

Jennifer Rothschild: It gets me all wistful and sweet.

K.C. Wright: And, of course, Michael W. Smith.

Jennifer Rothschild: (Singing) And a friend's a friend forever.

K.C. Wright: (Singing) Forever, if the Lord's the Lord of them.

Jennifer Rothschild: Though my friend Paula says friends don't let friends sing "Friends." I think Michael O'Brien says that too. And I get it, 'cause -- yeah. But I love it.

And I gotta say, one of my sweetest memories, Kathy Troccoli -- you remember Kathy Troccoli?

K.C. Wright: Of course, yeah.

Jennifer Rothschild: All right. She's a singer, a great singer. And she and I had the privilege of ministering together and became friends. So one time -- this was early in our friendship -- she's at my church doing an evening event, and she was singing that James Taylor song, just call out my name -- you know, (singing) you just call out my name --

K.C. Wright: Oh, yeah, yeah.

Jennifer Rothschild: -- and you know wherever -- you know, that's a good friendship song.

K.C. Wright: Yeah.

Jennifer Rothschild: She asked me to sing it with her. Oh, my gosh. Because she can sing, right?

K.C. Wright: Yeah, yeah.

Jennifer Rothschild: It was -- I wish I had a recording of it, just because I don't remember a thing about it. I was so stinking nervous, I think I, you know, was sick at my stomach when it was finally over.

But, yeah, that was one of the sweetest things singing that song "You've Got a Friend" with Kathy Troccoli.

So anyway, yeah, I love friendship songs, and that's what we're going to talk about today. Do you have any other favorite friendship songs?

K.C. Wright: Oh, my goodness. Well, I am thinking about, you know, the little sayings we go together like peanut butter and jelly.

Jennifer Rothschild: Oh, yeah?

K.C. Wright: Like Laurel and Hardy?

Jennifer Rothschild: Yes?

K.C. Wright: There's a song I used to play on the radio with these lyrics --

Jennifer Rothschild: Really?

K.C. Wright: -- that go something like that.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yeah, and it was about friendship.

K.C. Wright: We're like Snoopy and Charlie. I can't remember the song, but it's a friendship song.

Jennifer Rothschild: Okay. Well, there you go. That's okay, because half of us can't remember the friendship songs. I can tell you why I have trouble remembering is because I'm about to have -- drumroll, please --

K.C. Wright: (Making drumroll sound.)

Jennifer Rothschild: -- a milestone birthday --

K.C. Wright: Oh, it's a big one.

Jennifer Rothschild: -- in just a few days.

K.C. Wright: Yes.

Jennifer Rothschild: Okay, friends. K.C. had his big milestone birthday in September.

K.C. Wright: I did.

Jennifer Rothschild: Mine is in just a few days. And I will give you one hint. We're not going to tell you how old we are, because we want to look very young in your imagination.

K.C. Wright: True story.

Jennifer Rothschild: But we are a decade apart. I'm not even going to tell you which one of us is older, though you probably know.

K.C. Wright: Yeah.

Jennifer Rothschild: But I'm about to have a big, big milestone birthday. And James Taylor singing "You've Got a Friend" was definitely part of my decade when I was coming of age.

So anyway, today Elizabeth Thompson is going to be talking about what happens when a friendship fails. And unfortunately, this is a very relevant topic, because all of us have felt the sting of loving a friend and that friend, you know, just breaking up with us. So let's talk about how to avoid bitterness when it comes to a friendship not working out like we had hoped. So let's introduce Elizabeth.

K.C. Wright: Elizabeth Thompson is the author of many books for women and teenagers, including the "When God Says" series. As a speaker and novelist, Elizabeth loves finding humor in holiness and hope in heartache. She lives in beautiful North Carolina, and her preacher husband is a man of God that she loves with everything she has --

Jennifer Rothschild: I love that.

K.C. Wright: -- and they've got four spunky kiddos. That's a full life right there.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yeah, it is.

K.C. Wright: So pull up a chair to the table and listen in to this powerful conversation.

Jennifer Rothschild: Elizabeth, there are people who are listening right now who have had friendships that have fallen apart, and they're sitting here in the aftermath of the confusion and the heartbreak and all the things. Okay. So you've written a book about this, so my question would be, do you have some personal experience, like, with friendship breakups? Do you know how our listeners feel right now?

Elizabeth Thompson: I wish I didn't, but I do. And I think friendship breakups are one of the most painful kinds of losses. I know when I have been through this, it's this complicated cocktail of emotions. I think there's a lot of shame and regret. I think -- because in any friendship breakup, you feel a sense of guilt like, What did I do wrong? You feel insecure like, Am I unlikable? Am I unlovable? Am I, like, secretly destroying my other friendships? There's just so much complicated, negative emotion that goes along with it, and so -- yes, I have experienced this, I have experienced it.

One of the stories I tell in the book happened the day before my wedding.

Jennifer Rothschild: Oh, no.

Elizabeth Thompson: It was awful. I called a friend to give her some information she had been waiting on for me, and she was just -- she had all this pent-up bitterness toward me that she had never brought up until that moment. And she was just like, "You know, I feel like you've been really selfish as you've been planning your wedding, and I'm just done." And I was floored. Utterly blindsided. Did not see this coming. You know, it's the day before my wedding. And I just pleaded with her like, "I'm so sorry. I didn't know I'd been hurting you. Can we please make this right when I get back from my honeymoon?" Like, "I want to make this right with you." And sadly, she didn't want to reconcile. I never spoke with her again.

That was, I think, one of my most catastrophic and dramatic losses. I've had others, you know, that have faded through the years, and I think we've all experienced that.

Jennifer Rothschild: Oh, yeah. And the thing is it's funny because it can show up in different ways given different personalities and, you know, relationships. But you really described it well. And one of the things I appreciate about what you described, Elizabeth, is sometimes I think, you know, we just kind of think, well, it's just a friendship. I shouldn't feel this way or -- you know. So my question would be, how is this friendship loss particularly different from other kinds of loss, like death or divorce or maybe breaking up with a boyfriend? Because sometimes we take those more seriously or we think they're more a serious loss. So you already mentioned some of those feelings, but how is a friendship breakup different?

Elizabeth Thompson: Well, you know, one of the ways that I think it's different is it can be very difficult to talk about and, therefore, to get the support and help that you need in the aftermath because, you know, usually we're a part of a friend group. And so if one relationship is struggling, chances are it's intertwined with a lot of your other friendships and it gets really messy and tricky. And you don't want to gossip, you don't want to make people take sides, you don't want to make someone look bad, and so you can kind of feel like, oh, my goodness, I'm really hurting and I need advice and I don't know what to do. I can't talk to anyone.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yeah, yeah.

Elizabeth Thompson: And you're not going to, like, post it on social media looking for comfort from the masses, so --

Jennifer Rothschild: Right.

Elizabeth Thompson: -- I think it's a very private, personal kind of loss that can be hard to get the help you need.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yeah. Because if someone dies, or if there's a divorce or a breakup with a boyfriend or girlfriend or whatever, there is this sense of, oh, yes, we all want to rally around that loss. But you're right, there is a complexity. And I'm glad you're bringing that up, because even that sets us free to know that, okay, these are some legit feelings and some legit isolation that we're feeling if we're in that situation. And often I think we think of this whole friendship thing as a young person thing, you know. And most of our listeners are women, so I'm just going to say a young women thing, you know, like high school, in our 20s, whatever.

So I'm curious your opinion, do you think friendship loss can happen at any life stage? And is there, like, a certain life stage where friendships are hardest to navigate?

Elizabeth Thompson: Well, I do think it can happen at any age and stage. It's funny, as I was writing this book and people would ask me -- friends would ask, you know, "Hey, what are you working on right now?" and I'd say, "Well, it's kind of a tough topic. I'm writing about friendship loss actually." But let me tell you, every woman that I mentioned this topic to said -- they just got this knowing look on their face and they said, you know, "I've been through that." And it didn't matter what age or stage of life they were in, everybody had been through it. I do think they tend to be a little bit more dramatic and frequent in our younger years when we have less experience with maybe conflict resolution and, you know, we just don't know, so we panic and we ghost people, I think, in our younger years.

But one of the stories that I tell in the book -- I interviewed different women who had been through this, and with their permission shared parts of their stories. And these two women had been friends for a long time, and they were in their 50s, late 50s, and they experienced a break in their friendship that they -- strong Christian women, two of the godliest women I know, they could not resolve this. And they went three years without speaking and it was -- oh, it was devastating for both of them. You know, but God worked independently on both women. And their story is actually incredibly redemptive, wonderful, a beautiful testament to grace and the Holy Spirit and the power of God to change us.

But, you know, this happened older in life, and they had a lot of friendship experience under their belt, and yet they still experienced it. I think we can all face it at different times in our lives.

Jennifer Rothschild: Well, and we're going to talk in a minute about maybe forgiveness and reconciliation, because I think that's part of it. But I also do -- you know, I've had experiences similar. And my question to you would be this. There is a weird word that comes into friendships: expectation. And I think -- like even maybe the story you told about before your wedding, perhaps your friend's expectation was different than yours, you were naive to what she was experiencing because maybe you weren't aware of her expectation. Maybe in older years, you know, our expectation -- one friend may have a different expectation than another. So let's talk about that. How do expectations toward each other play into a friendship that is stronger, versus one that ends up failing, and how can we be honest about our expectations?

Elizabeth Thompson: Yes. I think mismatched expectations are one of the big, big causes of rifts in friendships, when, you know, I think what being a good friend -- being a good friend means this certain set of behaviors and this certain level of engagement, how often we get together, how we express our friendship and our devotion to one another. You think something different and so we're unintentionally disappointing one another and hurting each other's feelings without even realizing it, you know.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yeah, right.

Elizabeth Thompson: A lot of this comes down to -- you know, we've all heard of the love languages. And sometimes when there's a mismatch in friends with different love languages and we don't recognize that. Maybe you're saying all the words and I'm just giving all the gifts, and both of us are feeling not loved. Or maybe you're a quality time person and I'm like, hey, we can just send each other encouraging texts and hang out once every six months and I'm good, and you're, like, over there devastated.

So I think the more clear we can be with one another, and even just being honest about those small hurts and misunderstandings before they become big. Like, I wish my friend had said early on, Hey, I felt disappointed that you didn't make time for me in the middle of your wedding planning. Like, you blew me off when I asked to go out for coffee. I could have fixed it early on if I had realized, oh, that matters to her. I think giving one another a chance to fulfill our expectations or maybe even just tweaking our own expectations, realizing maybe I'm -- you know, I'm asking a little unfair.

Jennifer Rothschild: Right, right.

Elizabeth Thompson: Something's unfair right here.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yeah, just having that honest conversation.

Well, and that leads me to this very specifically, because expectations, honesty, maybe being unclear leads to some of this breakdown that we don't intend. So what are some more -- maybe there are some more different ways or reasons that friendships fall apart?

Elizabeth Thompson: I do think another big reason is just not being honest early enough. When we are feeling some dysfunction or feeling hurt, just kind of letting it go. Now, I will confess that I really struggle with conflict. It's so difficult for me. Like, I physically feel ill. I won't sleep if I know I need to have a difficult conversation with someone. So I am someone who is tempted to do this, to just kind of, "Well, that's not a big deal. Let me just let it go." And certainly we don't need to nitpick one another. There's a place for just grace and letting things go for sure.

But if there's something that just keeps nagging, keeps nagging, and you feel it as building into a barrier in your friendship, the earlier you can open up and say, "I just need to say this." And, you know, "Maybe it's just me, I just need to be honest." Or even just ask the question and just say, Hey, I felt insecure when you said this. I took it that you meant X, Y, Z. Maybe you didn't. Could you clarify for me so I don't feel weird? Those conversations are so helpful in preventing future problems down the road.

Jennifer Rothschild: Well, and what you just described is humility in action. And sometimes I think we don't prefer to be vulnerable or humble and we're the ones who eventually are injured because of it.

I remember many years ago, a friend who -- I don't like conflict or confrontation either -- but she had ghosted me. And I loved her. And I also really thought I've surely done something wrong, you know, so I constantly text her, "Can you just be honest, what did I do?" She just literally wouldn't respond. Okay. So I finally had to let it go and just be like, okay, I need to forgive her. That's hard.

So let's talk about forgiveness, because sometimes we just need to forgive. So what are some of those forgiveness myths that we need to debunk so that we can actually move on and forgive?

Elizabeth Thompson: Yeah. You know, I do think forgiveness is hard. It's hard enough as it is, but sometimes I think we put pressure on forgiveness that isn't really there in the form of these myths. You know, I think one of the biggest ones is we feel like I can't forgive until she totally gets it, how much she hurt me, you know?

Jennifer Rothschild: Right. Yes.

Elizabeth Thompson: And we tie our forgiveness to the other person's response.

And, you know, I am so grateful that God didn't do that to us, that he didn't hold us to that. I can never get it, how much Jesus suffered on the cross for me. I will never get what it felt like for God to watch his Son die for me. Thank goodness he doesn't make me. He forgives me anyway. And I think God calls us in forgiveness. Sometimes we have to forgive without the other person acknowledging, you know, and really understanding what we've been through. Because they can't step inside -- even if they want to, even if their heart is in a good place, they can't step inside our heart and head to feel all the hurt that we felt. So I think the minute we release that expectation, it frees us up to forgive. That's one big friendship myth that I think we can let go.

You know, the other thing that I like to remind myself and others of is friendship -- forgiveness is really a sacred offering that you make to God. In a way, it has nothing to do with the other person. She can be involved in it, she cannot be involved in it, but this is something that happens in prayer with you and God, where you release it and he sets you free from that bitterness that wants to chain up your heart.

Jennifer Rothschild: Ooh, that's good. It really is unto the Lord.

And I remember one time, Elizabeth -- Stormie Omartian, you know, she's the power of the praying everything author. And she one time -- the phrase I remember she wrote was, "Forgiveness does not make the other person right; it makes you free."

Elizabeth Thompson: Yes.

Jennifer Rothschild: And I even remember many years later, this person that I mentioned finally did come to me -- and it was years. And she said, "I'm so sorry. I was going through a bad time. I should have" -- whatever. I don't even remember it because it doesn't matter now. But anyway, of course, I had already forgiven her, I was already free, but that didn't mean I was ready to jump in with full trust again, you know. And I think that's important to recognize, that just because we forgive, and it is an earnest forgiveness, does not mean that we cannot still set up boundaries for the future, you know. Because I think that is also part of communicating well. And it doesn't mean you're mean to someone at all. It just means you're alert, that you're alert to guard your heart.

Okay, so now let's get to this. So forgiveness, yes. Then sometimes there is a place to reconcile and a time to reconcile. And so someone listening might be like, well, maybe I do need to try to reconcile with this person. So what advice would you give to someone who's feeling that, trying to reconcile with a friend? Like, what could that conversation sound like?

Elizabeth Thompson: Oh, they're so tricky.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yeah.

Elizabeth Thompson: They really are. One of the things -- and actually, I have to credit one of my friends for helping me sort of ponder this as we were discussing what does this look like and we were thinking about Scriptures. And she really helped me with this. That when you're going to someone -- especially if you need to express some feelings that you have, watch your pronouns. And what I mean by that is instead of going in the conversation saying, you know, you did this and that was selfish, and you were rude, you were selfish, you, you, you, go in with a focus on, you know, when you said this, I felt this. I felt insecure, I felt belittled, I felt taken advantage of. I remembered a time and was brought back to a time where I had a previous hurt, and so I responded more dramatically than I usually would. Sort of put the focus on, hey, here's how I felt and how I responded to what, you know, you said or you did, and that just keeps the temperature down a little, so you're not slinging accusations, you're sharing feelings. And I think that helps the other person be more able to receive what you're trying to share.

It also helps if you can lead with an apology. If you can find what you can own in the friendship situation, just say, okay, I recognize that I made you feel this way and I'm so sorry. If there is something to apologize for, lead with humility, lead with that apology, and then just share from the heart rather than slinging accusations.

Jennifer Rothschild: That's such a good word. Such a good distinction also. And again you said the word humility. I mean, pride messes up everything, doesn't it? Including friendships. So, yes, there is no reconciliation without humility. And Lord willing, the humility will occur on both parts. But it might not. So if you can't reconcile with the friend, what are some other options for making peace in the relationship and even in your own heart?

Elizabeth Thompson: Yes. You know, certainly we all long for reconciliation in most cases. We want that complete restoration of friendship, or at least restoration of some kind of fellowship. Sometimes a close friendship isn't possible or isn't beneficial on the other side of a break. But if you're unable to achieve that, I encourage people just to find a place of resolution. And sometimes it just means calling a truce, sort of saying, hey, we're going to just call an end to the conflict here, we're going to both go our separate ways, we're just going to let this go. And I think we even have Biblical examples of that. King David and King Saul.

Jennifer Rothschild: Oh, yeah.

Elizabeth Thompson: Of course, David wasn't a king yet. You know, poor David was being pursued, hunted by Saul, and David called a truce. And it was clear they were never going to be BFFs again, but just said, Hey, can we just stop the conflict? This is the best I can do here. There's a truce.

I think we actually have this really complex example in Scripture in Acts 15 of the Apostle Paul and Barnabas, two amazing godly men who had been best friends, missionary partners. They reached an impasse where they just had to agree to disagree. The Bible tells us they had such a sharp disagreement that they parted ways. And as much as I'm sad for those brothers that that happened to them, I'm grateful it's there for our sake, because I do think there are times when a resolution simply means, you know what? We may never see eye to eye on that, we may have to part ways, but I wish you well. I forgive you, you forgive me, we understand that we see this differently. We're both godly people trying to see this through a lens of Christianity, and somehow we're not seeing eye to eye. We're going to hand it over to God and we're just going to go our separate ways and trust that God will work out the rest.

Jennifer Rothschild: That's such a good word. I agree with you on that, I really do. And I'm so grateful -- like you said, I'm sorry it happened to the dudes in the Bible, but I'm grateful we have the example, because this is real life. And especially, y'all, let's just be honest, if it can happen to the men, ooh, it's going to happen to the ladies, because we love our relationships with our girlfriends. There's just nothing like it. I'm thankful for my girlfriends.

All right, Elizabeth, I'm grateful you have this book, because clearly there is so much here, and I'm highly recommending it. If someone's just in the process of trying to figure out friendship and a friendship maybe that went south, this is just such a good resource.

But we're going to get to our last question, because there's somebody identifying right now and she's like, well, I tried to forgive; that didn't work. I mean, I'm doing it, I'm trying. I tried to reconcile; that was a no-go. Okay, I wish I could do exactly what Elizabeth described where we both just decide to agree to disagree and move on and love each other and not gossip about each other. Okay. I wish all that were true, and I'm trying, but here I am now sitting alone and I'm missing my relationship. So what would your advice be to this woman who has been burned by friendship and she is terrified to try again? What would you tell her?

Elizabeth Thompson: Oh, my goodness. First I would say I'm so sorry. I have been there. It is not a fun place to be. But I would encourage you to really lean into your friendship with God. You know, that is where we can put all of our confidence, all of our security. He is the friend who will never fault or fail or leave us. We can always lean into that friendship.

And, you know, I tell the story in the book about my daughter Sawyer, who one day we went for a walk on the beach, shell hunting. And Sawyer has one of the most open hearts to friendship I have ever seen in any human. Every week she comes home with this little new scrap of paper with some new friend's mom's phone number saying, "Can you set up a playdate for me and this new friend?" So sweet.

But we were shell hunting on the beach, and this heart that she has came out in the shell hunting. Here I am looking, scouring the sand, only willing to pick up the perfect shells, you know. And I was so picky. Everything looked broken or just wasn't just right. Meanwhile, Sawyer is in raptures of delight over every broken shell. She found something beautiful in every one. And we walked off the beach, I had maybe two shells. She had, like, her pockets exploding, mine exploding with these beautiful broken shells that she had collected. And I went home and I thought, you know, God taught me a lesson through my daughter and her willingness to embrace what is broken, to find beauty in it, to just see what God saw in all these beautiful broken shells.

And I think sometimes if we can not pressure ourselves to be unbroken -- because we are -- offer our broken little selves to others with what courage God gives us, and also maybe stop looking for the perfect friend, but just be willing to love the broken people, broken but beautiful people that God has put around us, then we are a lot more likely to find a new friend, to be able to have the courage to bring someone new into our heart, to take those little risks, to open up, be a little bit vulnerable, and see what beautiful thing God produces in a potential new friendship.

K.C. Wright: I love those thoughts. Embrace what is broken. Find beauty in it. See what God sees in all of us, brokenness and beauty.

Jennifer Rothschild: That's so beautiful. You're right.

And I love that she said we should offer our broken selves to others. We need to be willing to love the broken people, too, because we are them. And when we do, we are the richer. And remember that she also said lean into your friendship with God, because you can put all your confidence there. He will never, ever, ever leave. He is the friend who sticks closer than a brother.

K.C. Wright: Well, you need her book, so it's a good thing we are giving one away.

Jennifer Rothschild: Yay.

K.C. Wright: Woot, woot. Go to Jennifer's Insta right now, @jennrothschild, to enter to win. Also, of course, you can go to the Show Notes to get Elizabeth's book, and also you can read a full transcript of this entire podcast. It's right there at 413podcast.com/276.

All right. Sadly, we're done for the day.

Jennifer Rothschild: We're done.

K.C. Wright: This episode is a wrap. Now, get your phone and text or call that friend who came to mind while you were listening to this podcast.

Jennifer Rothschild: Good word.

K.C. Wright: He or she needs to hear from you. You can because you can do all things through Christ who gives you supernatural strength. I can.

Jennifer Rothschild: I can.

K.C. Wright: And --

Jennifer Rothschild: You can.

K.C. Wright: -- you can.

Hey, and just as Dr. Phil had our backs today by running and getting that laptop, I want to brag on J.R. She is such a good friend. Like, seriously, when I walk in the door, every time, guys, every time, she says, "You need coffee. I can tell you need coffee. Here's a hot cup of coffee," that she makes, by the way. And then about three minutes later, "You know what? You're hungry. I know you're hungry." What friend does that? My favorite quote by J.R. is, "Friends don't let friends drink bad coffee."

Jennifer Rothschild: It's true. And, K.C., I also like you better when you have good blood sugar, so I'm going to constantly feed you.

K.C. Wright: That is true.